Five anti-vax lies I read on the internet

How do you know if someone is ignorant about vaccination? They claim to have “educated” themselves by “researching” the subject on anti-vax websites on the internet.

Let’s leave aside for the moment the fact that being educated about vaccines involves learning microbiology, immunology and virology, and let’s leave aside the fact that while “reading” and “research” begin with the same two letters, they are not the same thing. The main reason why it is impossible to become educated reading anti-vax websites is that they are filled with pseudo-knowledge, not factual information.

What is pseudo-knowledge? Pseduo-knowledge contains big, scientific words and sounds impressive. It contains actual facts, although they are entirely unrelated to the benefit being touted. It contains completely fabricated claims that have no basis in reality and which, not coincidentally trade on the gullibility of some lay people and it asserts that “we know” things that are flat out false.

Anna Kata, a professor of anthropology at McMaster University, has investigated the reliability of the information in anti-vax websites. Her paper, A postmodern Pandora’s box: Anti-vaccination misinformation on the Internet, appeared in the journal Vaccine in 2010. Kata analyzed the content of the eight most popular American and Canadian anti-vaccination websites (popularity determined by Google) for factual accuracy. These websites were (as of May 2009):

Global Research.ca – http://www.globalresearch.ca
Vaccination – http://www.vaccination.co.uk*
*website (homepage only) now archived at http://web.archive.org/web/
20080610121307/http://www.vaccination.co.uk/
Vaccination Debate – http://www.vaccinationdebate.com*
*website now hosted at http://www.vaclib.org/sites/debate/index.html
Vaccination Liberation – http://www.vaclib.org
Vaccination News – http://www.vaccinationnews.com/
Vaccine controversy –Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia – http://en.wikipedia.org/
wiki/Vaccine controversy
VRAN: Vaccination Risk Awareness Network – http://www.vran.org
WHALE – Vaccine website – http://www.whale.to/vaccines.html

Not surprisingly, Kata found that 100% of the websites contained factually inaccurate information, (aka lies):

Lie #1 Vaccines are poison.

… Every site claimed vaccines are poisonous and cause idiopathic illnesses. Sites stressed that vaccines contain substances poisonous to humans, including anti-freeze, ether, formaldehyde, mercury, and nanobacteria. Pertinent information was not elaborated upon – for instance, that the amount of potentially harmful substances …

Lie #2 Vaccines don’t work.

Questioning whether vaccines actually conferred immunity was also common (on 88% of sites). This included propositions that vaccination weakens the immune system, or that immunity is ineffective because vaccinated individuals still contract diseases. Many websites (88%) pointed to decreases in disease levels occurring before mass immunizations; credit was given only to improvements in sanitation, nutrition, and poverty levels.

Lie #3 Vaccine prevetable illness aren’t that serious.

Half the websites asserted that VPDs are trivial. One website described smallpox as “harmless under proper treatment [. . .] And not considered deadly with the use of homeopathy [. . .] And it certainly didn’t appear to be that infectious, if infectious at all”. Another site maintained that infections such as measles improved a child’s health, pronouncing, “the symptoms do not constitute the disease but the cure”. Serious complications of VPDs were not acknowledged – for example, that in developed countries, 1 in 1000 children with measles develop encephalitis and 1–2 in 1000 die.

Lie #4 It’s a conspiracy.

The conspiracy theory theme was present on every website analyzed. Most sites (75%) made accusations of a cover-up, where regulatory bodies purportedly have information about vaccines they are hiding from the public. Equally as common(75%) were suggestions that vaccination is motivated solely by a quest for profit. Allegations of collusion were present on 63% of websites, where pharmaceutical companies and physicians were accused of benefiting from vaccine reactions as harmful side effects keep them in business. Similarly, 50% of websites were suspicious that governments protect vaccine manufacturers and doctors from possible harms caused by vaccines.

Lie #5 Fantastical allegations.

Many websites (88%) made claims unsupported by evidence, including that: smallpox is not contagious (but rather spread by bedbugs); autism is caused by “stealth viruses”; and polio is caused by sugary foods (as the disease was more prevalent in summer, and thus linked to increased ice-cream consumption). One site questioned whether rabies was a psychosomatic manifestation rather than a viral disease, and recommended against vaccinations when bitten by wild animals.

It’s hardly surprisingly that lay people who imbibe this misinformation are afraid to vaccinate their children. And it is difficult to change the minds of misinformed lay people because they lack the understanding of science, immunology and statistics that is REQUIRED as a foundation to even discuss vaccine effectiveness and safety. Nonetheless, we can come up with a rule of thumb for assessing who is truly knowledgeable about vaccination:

A claim of being “educated” about vaccination by “researching” on the internet is prima facie evidence of thorough-going ignorance.

  • Mike Stevens

    Only five?
    I read about 40 antivax lies every day, sometimes more…

    • shay simmons

      Anti-vaxxers are like the Queen in “Alice.”

      “Alice laughed. ‘There’s no use trying,’ she said. ‘One can’t believe impossible things.’

      I daresay you haven’t had much practice,’ said the Queen. ‘When I was your age, I always did it for half-an-hour a day. Why, sometimes I’ve believed as many as six impossible things before breakfast. There goes the shawl again!”

  • Joy Garner

    The author of this pile of big pharma drivel is attempting to make sure that as many children as possible are injured by vaccines. She is NOT an expert in immunology OR virology, and she’s simply been hired to spread big pharma LIES in order to protect their profits. Amy, you are an accessory to the systematic maiming and MURDER of an entire generation of children. SHAME on you! Your life had no meaning, no purpose, and no VALUE. Why don’t YOU go get the 300 of so shots the big pharma-controlled CDC says you need, and let us all know that that works out for you? (if you’re still alive that is;-)

    • AllieFoyle

      What the eff are you on about?

      Murdered? Maimed? By vaccines? You really should seek psychological help if you think there is some conspiracy to hurt and kill children with routine immunizations.

      You know, most people HAVE had the CDC recommended immunizations and choose to immunize their children, and it’s working out pretty great for us all, what with the lack of preventable communicable diseases — which really did kill and maim children throughout history, as any reasonably intelligent non-paranoid person recognizes.

      Seriously, think about it.

      • Joy Garner

        Parent are all telling the same story, but doctors and nurses almost always refuse to report ANYTHING that happens after vaccines, as an “adverse” reaction, even death. This is because they get paid bonuses for meeting vaccination quotas, and they don’t want to lose that money. 95% of revenue for medical journals is provided by big pharma. 60 to 70 of advertising revenue for mainstream media if provided by big pharma. Directors and officials at both the CDC and the FDA make person fortunes off of big pharma. Anyone who believes anything that these sources have to say, probably has an easy time believing in Keebler Elves too. We have an autism epidemic that MIT recently exposed as being on a perfect parallel with increased vaccine schedules, showing that in less than 9 years from now, the present generation of kids will be autistic. The CDC then faked their own report in response, claiming that the autism epidemic had “stabilized”. However, the CDC’s report left out ALL children under the age of 3, in order to cover the true picture. Turns out the autism rate for children under 3 is 13% now. The CDC LIED in their report. The rate of autism is increasing in younger kids in perfect alignment with the increased number of vaccines being given to children and babies. Epilepsy is epidemic now as well, at over 5% of children. The parents are all telling the same story- not a SINGLE seizure until the vaccines, and usually they begin almost immediately after the shots. Someone like you has probably never once even read a package insert on a vaccine, so your ideas about this subject clearly do not extend beyond the pre-package propaganda spit out by big pharma and their literal army of well-funded internet troll bloggers, (like the one hired to run this site, “Amy” – she’s an INFAMOUS big pharma shill, being paid $$ for her lies) trolls, and outright LIARS. Go back to your Keebler Elves, and keep telling yourself, “My government loves me. Big Pharma loves me. My TV would never lie to me. Doctors who make a fortune selling vaccines would never lie about them. I don’t ever need to read a package insert for a vaccine because my doctor would never hurt me for money” (even though it is now OFFICIAL that doctors are the 3rd leading cause of death in the USA right now;-)

        • MaineJen

          …keebler elves?

        • AllieFoyle

          Parents are all telling the same story? That’s funny. I’m a parent and my healthy, fully immunized kids just went to school with their healthy immunized friends. We’re pretty much happy and satisfied that we have the opportunity to protect our kids from diseases like polio and measles now.

          The idea of a connection between vaccines and autism has been thoroughly debunked. Autism is not an epidemic, and it isn’t caused by vaccines. I’ve worked with children with autism, and their families do not all tell the vaccine->autism story. Many of them could tell quite early on that something was different. There’s a lot of legitimate scientific research being conducted looking at what actually does seem to contribute to the development of autism, and much of it shows that genetics is involved. Maybe try reading some of that before looking at the same conspiracist sources that confirm and reinforce what you already think.

          You keep mentioning the package inserts — why? I’ve read some of them, as have lots of folks who choose to immunize — what is supposed to be in them that is so horrible and terrifying?

          And what is this MIT study you keep referencing without citations or links?

    • momofone

      If you are not vaccinating, YOU are an accessory to the potential harming of children and other vulnerable individuals through exposure to potentially life-threatening (and preventable) illnesses.

      • Joy Garner

        If you ARE vaccinating YOU are contributing to the 50% autism rate of this current generation of kids, that MIT has reported will happen within the next 9 years. In response to MIT’s report, the big pharma controlled CDC released a report claiming that in 2015 the autism rate had “stabilized”. However, I found that the CDC’s faked report intentionally omitted all children under the age of 3, and for a VERY good reason. In kids under three, the autism rate is now a staggering 13%, or 13 in every 100 kids. There was no way to continue covering up the fact that this increase in autism perfectly parallels the increase in the vaccines schedules, without overtly omitting this age group. Good luck with your VILE and corrupt propaganda machine, created for no reason other than to sterilize, destroy, and even murder, an entire generation of kids. I hope at least ONE of these mutilated kids ends up being someone dear to you personally. But you’re so ignorant and greedy, you’d probably keep feeding and protecting this machine even if your own child died immediately after receiving the shots. Ewe. Your life has no purpose, no meaning, no value. If you’re so committed to depopulation, why don’t you start with YOURSELF?

        • momofone

          You are a menace, and an ignorant one.

          • Joy Garner

            I may be a “menace” to the pharmaceutical industry, but I am anything but ignorant. I have personally met with hundreds of families with vaccine injured kids, a tiny % of the entire picture out there. They ALL tell essentially the same story.

            Their child was fine, healthy and normal, (they usually have videos to back it up) UNTIL they received a round of vaccines. Some of them had their children DIE within hours of the shots. Almost all of them witnessed their child develop clear symptoms of acute poisoning and shock within minutes or hours of the shots.

            Many of these children had almost no return to any sort of normalcy afterwards and are now SEVERELY disabled. They were ALL immediately told by their doctors that there’s “no way” the reactions had ANYTHING to do with the shots.

            Doctors ALWAYS immediately RULE OUT the shots, leaving these parents with some retarded story about how it must be their “bad genes”.

            You may think MIT’s study, showing that autism is rising so fast, (in perfect parallel with the increased vaccine schedule) that in 9 years we are facing a 50% rate of autism in this generation of kids, but I do not.

            When confronted with MIT’s published work on this subject, the fully-discredited big pharma slaves at the CDC published a report, claiming that the autism epidemic had suddenly “stabilized” in 2015. However, the CDC intentionally omitted ALL children under the age of 3 from their figures, and for good reason. In children under 3, the autism rate is already at 13%.

            Had the CDC not deleted vital numbers, (FAKED their study) it would have proven MIT correct, (which they were anyway) showing that we ARE facing a 50% autism rate in this generation in less than 9 years from now. And it’s on a perfect parallel with the increased vaccination schedules.

            You WANT to live in this vaccine injured world where the next generation of people in the USA will be 50% autistic. You are ignorant, not the people at MIT.

          • MaineJen

            http://www.helpguide.org/articles/autism/autism-symptoms-and-early-signs.htm

            “Although autism is hard to diagnose before 24 months, symptoms often surface between 12 and 18 months.” This is likely why they omitted children under 3. Babies are typically NOT diagnosed with autism, because the symptoms don’t become apparent until around age 2. This is why parents think that their “normal” child suddenly became autistic (coincidentally, around the same time the MMR vax is given at around 12 months).

          • The Computer Ate My Nym


            I may be a “menace” to the pharmaceutical industry,

            No, you aren’t. Not in the least little bit. If the pharmaceutical industry notices you at all–which they don’t, you’re just not that significant–they are happy that you’re reducing demand for their less profitable products.

          • momofone

            I’m not sure if you’re aware of this, but quantity of words does not equal quality of thought or reasoning.

          • The Computer Ate My Nym

            clear symptoms of acute poisoning

            How do you “develop symptoms of acute poisoning”? There are many, many poisons in the world, with many, many different symptoms. Heck, some of them are the antidotes of others.

            You WANT to live in this vaccine injured world where the next generation of people in the USA will be 50% autistic.

            Let’s pretend, just for a moment, that this is even possible or related to vaccines. So what? Who cares whether the next generation is mostly neurotypical or not? Mild autism is not particularly pathological. We’ll raise a nice crop of computer programmers and biologists. Politics may get odd as the average person starts to be more impressed by statistics and harder to charm into voting against their own interests, but that’s not such a bad thing, is it?

          • DelphiniumFalcon

            Hey, uh, fully funtional autistic person here. You do realize not everyone on the spectrum has reduced mental and self care abilities, right? A good portion of us basically just want people like you to stop point out how different we are. Because aside from people treating us like we’re weird or broken a lot of us that don’t have the most severe of symptoms don’t think there’s much to be angsty about. And maybe if 50% of the population were autistic we’d actually have an interest in helping the non-verbal and more severely afflicted among us communicate instead of writing them off as a lost cause.

            Resistance is futile. You will be assimilated.

          • demodocus

            well, you are a little weird, you trekkie you. 😉 Granted, I recognize the reference, so that makes me weird too. :p

          • DelphiniumFalcon

            Hey there’s getting stared at for actually being a weird nerd and then there’s getting stared at because you took something literally that was supposed to be (a bad) joke. One is a hobby of mine but the other is just plain annoying.

          • demodocus

            My husband does that too. He once took the old metaphor “cast-iron stomach” literally and thought I’d had some sort of stomach transplant…with cast iron?!

          • DelphiniumFalcon

            …I like the way he thinks though!

            Then again you’d probably want a cast iron colon. That’s usually what gets my husband. Yes he has a cast iron stomach. Not a cast iron colon and we both know this unfortunately. Doesn’t stop him from trying every ghost pepper chilli sauce he comes across though…

          • Nick Sanders

            Less than functional autistic person here. I can care for myself fine, but I’m not able to hold a meaningful job and support myself. Even so, I’m well aware that vaccines had nothing to do with my condition.

            And I find it vastly insulting for people like Joy to act as if I am some sort of pariah who should be shut away in a sanitarium, out of sight of the “normal people”.

          • Box of Salt

            Joy Gardner: there is no “MIT report.”

            Name the researcher(s) who wrote it -and see my earlier comment above.

            We do not live in a “vaccine injured world.” It’s a complicated world, and there are a lot of things – especially health related – that human beings do not fully understand.

            But the folks like you who attempt to spread your own misunderstandings to others are not increasing our knowledge base.

          • Heidi

            Nope, you’re just a menace. If you actually cared about people and their children and if what you spew you believe to be true, then you would actually try to be civil to them. Instead, you call everyone libtards, skanks, shills and snakes. You’ve even said you hope one us have someone dear to us end up with a mutilated kid. You thrive on this sick idea that you are right and the rest of us were wrong. You would much rather be right than to be wrong about this and all of your other conspiracy theories, and that just makes you a poor excuse of a human being.

          • demodocus

            My little sprite is fully vaccinated (except for HPV vaccine, which he’s too young to recieve.) He’s bright, highly verbal and sociable, and into everything. He also has nice clear eyes, unlike his father who contracted congenital rubella and therefore has been blind from birth.

          • LibrarianSarah

            Are their any other slurs that you like to use joy? How about calling us all faggots, dykes, kykes, niggers, and spicks? I mean if you can throw around the word “retard” with such ease those words mustn’t bother you either.

            You are trash.

          • MaineJen

            Not surprising from someone who six days ago called Michelle Obama a “weirdo tranny.”

            https://disqus.com/home/discussion/americanpatriotdaily/this_now_banned_by_michelle_obama/#comment-2676247733

          • LibrarianSarah

            Well I thought she was just a run of the mill crank who thinks she is smarter than she really is. Turns out she is an all out asshole.

            Hey Joy. If you are posting this shit under your real name, you might be one of the stupidest person on the planet and I feel immensely sorry for the poor shmucks who share a name with you.

        • Nick Sanders

          Do you enjoy lying?

          • Joy Garner

            I enjoy telling the TRUTH. The fact that you ONLY trust what big pharma and their shills have to say about their products, tells me you enjoy spreading lies. It also tells me you have lost the ability for critical or independent thinking, apparently lacking even two brain cells left to rub together. Whether they are paying you or not, you are part of their brainwashed machine, who is afraid to look at, let alone READ a vaccine package insert.

          • Nick Sanders

            Throwing a tantrum and calling me names doesn’t make you any less wrong, or change any minds.

          • Sarah

            Joy love, there’s no point reading a vaccine package insert if you’re incapable of understanding the fucker. You don’t get any cookies for being able to make out the letters.

          • LibrarianSarah

            If pharma companies are nefarious liars with the government in their back pocket why would you believe the insert on a vaccine package is correct?

            Wouldn’t it make more sense if pharma companies are as evil and powerful as you claim for the ingredient list to be something like “water, kale, powdered unicorn horn, love, light and laughter” instead of all those scary sounding chemical names?

            It is almost like your worldview is utterly inconsistent with reality…

        • MaineJen

          13% of kids now have autism? Oh wow. You are special.

          • LibrarianSarah

            Not that there is anything wrong with that! /Seinfeldvoice

        • guest

          I know some autistic adults and children. They are wonderful people who would not want to change the way they are no matter what, and certainly not at the expense of other people’s lives.

        • LibrarianSarah

          That is a lot of words to say “I am an ablist bigot that objectifies special needs children and believes everything I read on the internet that assures me that I am really smarter than those with an actual education.”

          Be to each their own I guess.

        • Sarah

          Start with your face, you ableist turd.

    • MaineJen

      Oh hey! I know a little bit about immunology, as I work in the field. Do you have new data to share with us, and does it show that (300?) vaccines injure kids more than the diseases they prevent? If so, please do share!

      *sits down to wait*

      *starts knitting*

      • Joy Garner

        Can you produce “evidence” that vaccines have saved any lives? No, you can’t. It’s all theory, and absolutely no actual evidence. Literally every student that came down with Mumps at harvard recently, had been vaccinated against it. So you know “a little bit” about immunology. Nice. I suspect you believe that either you, or the OBGYN who owns and operates this site in exchange for a handsome reward from a vaccine maker, each know more than a Harvard trained immunologist as well? i am going to trust the immunologist, not an ignoramus with no facts, who has obviously never even read a vaccine package insert;-) Here’s what a real immunologist has to say: (And don’t think your employers can shut her up, or get the posts taken down by shill- asking for “proof” and then shutting the links off. Alll this is doing is pissing people off and PROVING that you are ALL hired shills. It’s far too late for your cover ups, The cat’s so far out of the bag now that NOTHING can stop it. https://alethonews.wordpress.com/2015/05/02/harvard-trained-immunologist-demolishes-california-legislation-that-terminates-vaccine-exemptions/

        • Who?

          What a lovely website. I doubt anyone agreeing to have anything published on it would expect to be taken seriously outside wingnut circles.

          Can I introduce you to the paragraph? It allows you to break up your thoughts into readable chunks, rather than leaving trails of word vomit.

          Thanks for playing.

        • Nick Sanders
          • Joy Garner

            How does a cover up job in a mainstream magazine, on the fact that 100% of the mumps cases at Harvard were in vaccinated people- also proving that it was most likely a vaccinated person who started the epidemic, (which could just as easily have been figured out be READING a vaccine insert which plainly states that after your shot you will be spreading this disease) PROVE that a single life has ever been “saved” because of a vaccine? How exactly?

          • MaineJen

            http://www.publichealth.org/public-awareness/understanding-vaccines/

            Anyone you know ever had smallpox? No? That’s funny. I wonder how that once deadly and frighteningly virulent disease was COMPLETELY ERADICATED from the earth.

            Must’ve been sanitation, amirite?

          • The Computer Ate My Nym

            No doubt. Sanitation. Funny how small pox was completely eliminated by sanitation and polio all but eliminated, but parvovirus, the various encephalitis viruses, and the thousands of cold viruses have been totally unaffected by sanitation. Terribly odd, that.

          • MaineJen

            I wonder what the tin foil hat brigade has to say about the eradication of smallpox?

            *crickets*

          • Sarah

            It was the breastmilk wot did it, obviously.

          • Nick Sanders

            also proving that it was most likely a vaccinated person who started the epidemic

            Well, that’s a nonsequitur.

            And you clearly don’t understand the inserts.

        • MaineJen

          Hey, how’s that polio you had last year? Oh, what’s that? You didn’t have polio? Ever? Because you were vaccinated as a child? Huh. That’s funny, because I seem to remember someone telling me that vaccines don’t save any lives.

          STILL waiting for my shill money. Damn, they are super late with the checks this month.

          Thanks for the laughs,
          Someone who knows a little bit about immunology

          • Joy Garner

            I am not buying the big pharma lie about polio. My mother lived through that era, and her father was a doctor BEFORE the vaccines hit the market in their community. They only EVER had two cases of polio, and BOTH of them were in recently vaccinated people, who were immediately quarantined because of it.

            Her father refused the next shipment of the vaccine to his community because it INSTANTLY became clear where these new infections had originated. Polio was already almost gone by the time they started distributing the vaccine. This whole storyline about polio is a MARKETING scheme. They are in business to make MONEY, and they don’t give a CRAP about anyone’s “health”.

            Just ONCE read a vaccine package insert. They all plainly state that after you get the shot, you will be “shedding” (code for SPREADING) the disease, and it also discloses that you may well come down with the disease as a result of the shot.

            The people telling the truth don’t make money off of the truth, and they don’t stand to LOSE money if the truth gets out. If you want to see a bit of truth about polio, go here: https://childhealthsafety.wordpress.com/graphs/

          • MaineJen

            Another tin foil hat blog. Not impressed.

          • MaineJen

            http://www.history.com/this-day-in-history/salk-announces-polio-vaccine

            “In 1952–an epidemic year for polio–there were 58,000 new cases reported in the United States, and more than 3,000 died from the disease.” “New polio cases dropped to under 6,000 in 1957, the first year after the vaccine was widely available.”

            But it was totes already dying out before the vaccine was discovered in 1953.

            You would be really entertaining if you weren’t so scary.

          • AllieFoyle

            “the big pharma lie about polio”

            I’m sorry, what? What about polio is a lie?

            Usually I think anti-vax people just don’t know any better, but I think you have a more serious problem. You dismiss the reality that many, many people have actually been maimed and killed by communicable diseases, and at the same time believe in an imaginary epidemic of children being willfully killed and maimed by a vast vaccine conspiracy — common sense and all evidence to the contrary.

          • AllieFoyle

            Yes, if you get a vaccine with live virus (OPV, which contains a weakened virus, for example) it is theoretically possible for you to transmit it to others. It’s an unlikely and unusual, but completely known and understood effect of live-virus vaccinations. It’s not a secret and it isn’t an issue at all with many vaccines, as they don’t contain whole or live virus particles.

            Again, what is it that you think is written in package inserts that is so damning? I’ve read them and I haven’t the foggiest what you are talking about.

          • MaineJen

            http://www.immunize.org/packageinserts/

            If anyone is interested, all of the package inserts can be found here. Happy reading…

          • Bombshellrisa

            How lucky you are not to know anything about post polio syndrome.

          • Sarah

            Oh well, if a member of your family lived through the era before polio vaccination, that totes qualifies you to have an opinion. I feel like there might be other people who also had relatives who lived in that time period, though? What’ll we do if we disagree?

        • Sarah

          Hired shills? Who do I call to get my money? I’ve not had a penny yet. Here was me slagging off anti-vaxxers for free!

      • Joy Garner

        Oh, and you might want to look up MIT’s report showing that at this present rate of increase, 50% of this current generation will be autistic in less than 9 years. The CDC responded to this exposure (to the loss of profits their owners might suffer as a result) by publishing a report claiming that the rate of autism had magically “stabilized” in 2015. However, upon closer inspection, I found that the CDC had intentionally omitted all children under the age of 3 in their report. The reason they did this, is because in children under 3 years, the rate is now a staggering 13%, 13 children per 100! This is the age group where the explosion is really showing up, and it’s on a perfect parallel with the increase in vaccination in this age group. Maybe you think a 50% severe autism rate in this current generation of children, just 9 years from now, is a small price to pay for a drug that has never actually been PROVEN to have saved a single life, but I beg to differ.

        • Nick Sanders

          Wait, how did you go from “50% autism rate” to “50% severe autism rate”. That’s quite a world of difference. Please source your claim.

          • LibrarianSarah

            A world with a 50% autism rate would, in some ways, be a better place than the one we have now. Vaccinate more people!

        • The Computer Ate My Nym

          “MIT” is not an investigator. What is the specific report citing a 50% rate of autism?

          • Joy Garner

            MIT contains our best minds when it comes to MATH, and they do not have a MOTIVE to lie about those numbers, the way the CDC does, because unlike the CDC, MIT does not make money for it’s directors and officers, off of selling big pharma products. Although MIT ran the NUMBERS correctly, (because they did not LIE about WHAT those numbers ARE, as the CDC had routinely been caught doing) MIT is not the best source for the actual cause, because they are not generally chemists, toxicologists, immunologists, etc.

            CAUSE can be swiftly be determined by talking to the actual parents of a large number of these injured children. It’s also pretty easy to figure out by reading the minimum required disclosures in the vaccine package inserts. But I can only assume YOU have never ONCE bothered to read a vaccine package insert, or we would not be having this conversation.

            Why don’t you take the time to READ just one vaccine package insert. Even with the what they are forced to disclose there, this isn’t really that hard to figure out, but you DO need to be capable of critical and independent thinking processes.

          • The Computer Ate My Nym

            MIT contains our best minds when it comes to MATH

            Um, okay. A high school friend of mine who went to MIT will be complimented, but it’s not a particularly relevant statement.

            MIT is not the best source for the actual cause, because they are not generally chemists, toxicologists, immunologists, etc.

            The MIT schools of biology, chemistry, biological and chemical engineering, etc beg to differ. You really have no idea at all how a university works, do you?

          • The Computer Ate My Nym


            Why don’t you take the time to READ just one vaccine package insert.

            Too late. I’ve already read dozens. They are generally rather underwhelming to someone who can read and process the information reasonably accurately and isn’t freaked out by polysyllabic chemical names.

          • LibrarianSarah

            Oh sweetie no.

            See, authority is constructed and contextual. Everyone is trying to sell you something even big name universities like MIT. What is important where someone is getting their money.

            The CDC is funded by the America taxpayer and it’s allocated funds are decided by congress. (I’m simplifying things a bit here.) The do not get money from pharmaceutical companies although they may GIVE money to pharmaceutical companies.

            Now I colleges get their money in from three main sources: 1. from student tuition 2. from alumni donations and 3. from grants. Grants are big money for colleges and universities. These grants come from either governments sources (including the *gasp* CDC), nonprofits, and for profit cooperations.

            I can pretty much guarantee that MIT is getting that sweet sweet pharma cash. In fact, most of the research that pharma uses to make their products comes from schools like MIT.

            So think about it. If you are a college that wants/needs grant money to stay afloat and you can get grant money by doing really new groundbreaking research, how are you going to report your research to the world? Are you going to say “this is a single study with plenty of confounding variables and that needs to be replicated for us to know if this means anything or was a huge waste of time? Or are you going to tout your research as “game changing” or “new and exciting?”

            Press releases or “reports” from colleges just as much advertisements as the ones you see on TV.

          • Nick Sanders

            The CDC doesn’t sell anything. It’s a publicly funded government agency that operates off of a budget. Care to try again?

          • The Bofa on the Sofa

            MIT is not the best source for the actual cause, because they are not generally chemists, toxicologists, immunologists, etc.

            Bwah ha ha ha ha ha ha!!!!!!

            In the >20 years I’ve been participating in internet discussion, this is probably the stupidest comment I have ever seen.

          • Nick Sanders

            Not even close for me. I saw someone claim they got Chronic Lyme Disease from a wasp sting, and that was just in the last month.

          • Charybdis

            Lyme Disease. From a wasp sting. There. Are. No. Words. Incredulous laughter, sure.

            Next thing you know someone will be claiming they got Zika from a cat scratch.

          • Nick Sanders

            Also within the last month, I had someone go on this glorious rant for telling them that toothpaste should not be used to treat pinkeye:

            Have you conducted a scientific experiment to conclude its not meant for the eye? Oh and when you do provide conclusive evidence, please conduct the same tests on oral use while you at it. Seeing that the chemicals contained in toothpaste does enter the body orally…

            Its easy just to sound trumpets of one’s own exclamations of intelligence as a means to prove to those nearest signs of one’s own intelligence, but does the alpha male need prove his dominance?

            Better the relief of a pink eye than to suffer the pain.

            Soon you will suffer the pain of pink eye, but will your pride prevent you from experimenting and rather have you suffer unnecessarily?

            We live in a world where professions profess to know the utter extent of the spectrums of knowledge, yet their findings are ever changing and contradicting that of old.. The same professionals abuse drugs and go against their own knowledge, and they exchange principle for lust.

            The day of trusting the professional has come to an end. Though they provide few services necessary for the needs of others, still, they grow ever obsolete.

            One profession professes his knowledge above another, while they all lie and contradict one another. Yet the learned man still possesses the arrogance and self deception when he claims knowledge of a higher source, as if he is not a human prone to err.

            So in regards to those who claim superiority: Sorry but we the people no longer trust your ways of bribery, conspiracy and a mind that is wielded by capital rather than principle.

          • Monkey Professor for a Head

            Toothpaste in the eye? That sounds like a very painful way to blind yourself!

          • DelphiniumFalcon

            I saw that one when you replied… I was going to make a reply but I felt like I’d just be falling down a black hole of pointlessness if they’re already stupid enough to post something like that.

          • guest

            We have to prove that toothpaste is not meant for the eye? The fact that it was specifically designed for cleaning teeth isn’t enough?

            I think I have to go lie down a for a little while.

          • momofone

            This sounds like exactly the right person to test toothpaste in the eye.

          • Nick Sanders

            According to them, they had done it in the past and it was their go to home remedy for pinkeye.

          • momofone

            Wow. I’m not sure I can find words for that.

          • demodocus

            probably more plausible, lol

          • Bombshellrisa

            What? How did they come to that conclusion.

          • Nick Sanders

            “I got stung by a wasp. Now, several months later, I have vague, hard to define symptoms and pain. The wasp sting must have given me Chronic Lyme Disease.”

            At least that’s what I gathered from their post.

          • Bombshellrisa

            Wow, ok. I don’t even know what to say.

          • MaineJen

            No! Remember the guy who tried to tell us that antibodies weren’t that important? …Although this one comes close.

          • LibrarianSarah

            Don’t you know Bofa? The best people to ask about a given topic are those who spend their time studying something else entirely. Knowing stuff about a subject makes you a shill.

          • Joy Garner

            And you think this statement is incorrect how? You think you are a better source of intel and data on the proections than the best minds at MIT? I stated that MIT is not going to provide the best data on specific cause, but their projections really can’t be argued. But you only trust those who have motives to lie, i.e., big pharma, the CDC, and the FDA, when all of these sources these have already been fully discredited and proven as producing total fraud. I say you should go get all of your shots, and don’t ever dare read a package insert okay? Good luck with that;-)

          • Nick Sanders

            but their projections really can’t be argued

            Especially since you refuse to actually cite them.

          • The Bofa on the Sofa

            And you think this statement is incorrect how?

            Because although I cannot attest to their toxicology or immunology, I can tell you from direct knowledge that MIT has some of the absolute best chemists in the world.

            Their chemistry department is one of the top 5 in the US. Probably #2 or 3, with only Berkeley being for sure ahead.

            So your claim that MIT generally aren’t chemists, etc, is complete lunacy.

            You clearly know NOTHING about MIT. Or science, for that matter.

          • BeatriceC

            Meh. I’d trust the professors at the University of Texas at Austin over the MIT guys when it comes to matters of statistical analysis and data extrapolation. MIT is good at what they do, but they’re far from the best statistics program in the country.

          • Box of Salt

            Joy Garner,
            why won’t you name the specific researcher at MIT who authored your study and came up with the notion that 50% of all children will be autistic in the not that distant future?

            Is it because you don’t want folks lurking to figure out who this person is? And because if they look into the study, they’ll find that the data doesn’t really support what you and your anti-vax cronies want it to?

            Name the researcher (provide a link the study) or stop pounding the study.

          • Who?

            Joy, what I love the most about your posts-do keep them coming-is their absolute blind confidence. ‘All’ ‘fully discredited’ ‘proven’ ‘total fraud’.

            Such blind confidence, and yet you won’t post the study.

          • Bombshellrisa

            If the pharmaceutical companies are such evil, deceitful entities, surely we can’t believe what they print on vaccine package inserts.

          • Joy Garner

            These disclosures are the bare minimum they are required to to supply. And even though they’ve done their best to play the risks and dangers down, it’s is still very frightening. But hey, for someone like you, it’s best you keep your eyes closed, wait for the force fed information from big pharma, and make sure to get all of your shots. This is best for someone like you. Only people I care about should actually read the inserts;-)

          • Nick Sanders
          • Bombshellrisa

            See, you don’t know if I am vaccinated. My immunity may have come from actually getting the disease.

          • Monkey Professor for a Head

            And who requires the disclosures? The government? Who according to your theory are trying to cover up the dangers of vaccines….

            Your theory seems to rest on a whole lot of people being evil, stupid, or both.

          • Bombshellrisa

            Everything is scary to someone who reads an insert and has no idea what all those big words mean.

          • Beth

            you know, if “Big Pharma” was going to use vaccines to give millions of kids a disease, as part of a nefarious plan to make money…

            wouldn’t it make more sense to give them a disease that can be treated? with products made by “Big Pharma”? as opposed to autism, which is not treatable with medications.

            if the goal is to make money, a much better evil plan would be to give millions of people tuberculosis. Treatment involves taking multiple meds over a long period of time. But a plan to make millions by giving 50% of children autism – how the hell is that supposed to work? It makes about as much sense as the underpants gnomes.

          • Bombshellrisa

            The underpants gnomes!!!
            It also shows how much they know about autism. They would rather have their child be blind, deaf or dead than autistic.

          • Joy Garner

            Oh, about that ‘source’ I guess you’re incapable of doing a google search? You’re HOPELESS.

          • The Computer Ate My Nym

            The burden of proof is on the person making the claim. Especially when providing such a vague reference as “MIT”. As previously noted, MIT is a big place, with lots of people doing research there. It is rather insulting to them to pretend that simply invoking the name MIT is enough to enable one to easily find a given study after a google search.

          • Charybdis

            Ahh, yes. The intelligence and wisdom of Teh Google.

            You can Google anything and find plenty of papers, articles, opinion pieces, blogs, etc. that you can cite to prove your point.

            The trick is knowing which of these have real research and testing behind them and which ones are bullshit; a trick which you have not learned. You can put something completely asinine out there and there will be plenty of people who will think it is a proven fact.

            “All cats die. Aristotle is dead. Aristotle was a cat!”
            Then you’d have people “investigating” this “truth” and you would eventually have a small group of diehard “Aristotle was a cat” believers who would try to persuade everyone else that it it TRUE!

            The door’s over there>>>>>>

          • LibrarianSarah

            Burden of proof is on you. YOU make a claim YOU need to back it up.

          • Nick Sanders

            There’s a reason I bookmarked a link to Burden of Proof. It is endlessly useful.

        • Box of Salt

          Joy Garner about your “MIT report”
          Please cite (provide a link to that report.
          But you also said : “I guess you’re incapable of doing a google search?”

          I don’t need to do a Google search. I think I already know exactly whose work you’re mentioning (and think we all should take seriously). You are discussing one individual from MIT who apparently believes that autism is caused by both Roundup *and* vaccines. And in spite of an engineering background, thinks that you can extrapolate incidence data into the future – hence that 50% soundbite.

          If I am wrong – if this person (whom you too can google) is in no way affiliated with that “MIT report” you think is so important, post the link.

          If not, I hope that the other readers of this comment section will realize that you are regurgitating nonsense.

        • LibrarianSarah

          you might want to look up MIT’s report showing that at this present
          rate of increase, 50% of this current generation will be autistic in
          less than 9 years.

          https://s-media-cache-ak0.pinimg.com/736x/11/6b/7d/116b7d3c4d1c6233e092ebf531f0609f.jpg

    • Nick Sanders
    • Sarah

      Just so you know, that first sentence would give Dr A a decent basis to pursue you for defamation in English law. And I’m reading it in England.

      • The Computer Ate My Nym

        It appears that brave Sir Joy ran away.

        • Nick Sanders

          She’ll probably be back. It’s the internet, people work on weird schedules.

          Personally I don’t call “gone” before the three day mark, just because shit can happen IRL to anyone.

    • Charybdis

      Are you an expert in immunology and/or virology? If not, then you don’t have a leg to stand on.

      OH, and look! I can CAPATALIZE random WORDS as well.

      Please ELABORATE on these 300 SHOTS that are MANDATORY and killing EVERYBODY!

  • margin

    Some of the claims you say the sites make are ludicrous and nowhere have I read that anti-vaccine individuals claim that small pox is caused by bed bugs or polio caused by ice cream. They have legitimate concerns and if you want to put their minds at ease, do a followup study on health for vaccinated versus unvaccinated, Take that issue off the table by doing that in your truly scientific method.

    • demodocus’ spouse

      Dr. T may be a bit hyperbolic in her analogies, but there have been lots of vaccinated v unvaccinated studies, the vast majority of which are inconclusive at most. Since I have to run after my toddler now, I’ll let those better suited tell you more about them.

  • I once believed in vaccination but have long ago arrived at the inevitable conclusion that vaccination is an organised criminal enterprise dressed up as disease prevention by means of junk science. Infectious disease mortality graphs clearly show that vaccines have never protected anyone or saved anyone’s life:

    http://www.vaccinationinformationnetwork.com/do-vaccines-save-lives-what-infectious-disease-mortality-graphs-show/

    I would be interested to know what Dr Tuteur has to say about them, as the graphs are based on official government statistics.

    Or the fact that some vaccines containing highly neurotoxic mercury are injected into babies, children and pregnant women..

    Dr Blaylock’s quote is from this article:

    http://www.vaccinationinformationnetwork.com/dr-russell-blaylock-vaccine-program-based-upon-nonsense-fear-fairy-tales/

    Also watch his excellent lecture ‘How vaccines harm child brain development’
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=7QBcMYqlaDs#t=27