December 18, 2015 | 195 Comments

Lactivism bingo

Lactivism bingo

Author:Amy Tuteur, MD

View all posts by Amy Tuteur, MD →
  • denise

    The CLSCs (local health centres ran by the province) in Quebec are all about breastfeeding. When I was pregnant and attended their prenatal classes, I totally drank their kool-aid of “unless you had breast surgery, everyone can breastfeed. Don’t worry, we will help if you have issues”. Well none of those brilliant nurse lactation consultants helped my baby to latch. She had hypoglycemia and jaundice and lost 10% of her weight. We were tortured with the nipple shield and formula method. Thank goodness for one nurse (the one who had recognized hypoglycemia) asked us if we could give her a bottle and said “breastfeeding is not for everyone and that is totally Ok”. I should have stuck with her advice, instead I spent three months trying to breastfeed. I was totally and utterly miserable. During this time I had two appointments at the hospital’s breastfeeding clinic with a doctor. She was very reasonable. My daughter was cluster feeding three hours in the middle of the night and she said “you know, if it exhausts you, just give her two ounces of formula, it is fine!! Even if you give her formula all day and breastmilk just twice a day, it will be fine!!”. When I told that to the nurse at the CLSC breastfeeding club the next day, the nurse almost fainted. She actually compared the 2 ounces of formula to giving the baby McDonald’s.
    What really gets me is these CLSC nurses are so quick to say “ohhhhhhh health Canada wants exclusive breastfeeding!!!” and yet they teach you all these dangerous sleep positions for you to breastfeed baby while you snooze. Last time I checked Health Canada advises against bed sharing.
    For various reasons, being miserable being the first, I switched to hypoallergenic formula. To my surprise and great relief, my pediatrician said I was doing a favour to myself and my daughter.

    • denise

      Oh and ironically, it is that 60 ml of formula that helped me last three months. It made my daughter sleep longer, so I actually had some energy for the day time “torture”. I would have quit way before if it weren’t for that.

  • Amy

    One quibble. Bottom left corner should read, “Are you MAMA enough?” Moms are never MAMA enough.

  • niteseer

    There were no bottle fed babies in my family prior to this generation, back until the dawn of time. Like, never. And my family is rife with arthritis, heart disease, asthma, immuno disorders, obesity, depression, and especially diabetes. But of this newest generation, who were all bottle fed, 75% of them have escaped all of that. I am a medical trainwreck, but my three kids (adults now), who were only breastfed for a few weeks, have none of those issues. (and praying that stays true for all their lives.

    So, I am not seeing the stellar advantages breastfeeding did for me and my forebears.

  • Froggggggg

    A new one I just randomly stumbled across on an Instagram post talking about breastfeeding difficulties related to poor latch: “You have to want to” (breastfeed, that is)… UGH. Nothing like a passive-aggressive hint at a lack of willpower when someone is already upset.

  • An Actual Attorney

    OT: Are any of the docs here based in or familiar with the DR? I’m on vacation and have a question.

    • fiftyfifty1

      not me. sorry.

    • attitude devant

      DR?

      • An Actual Attorney

        Dominican Republic.

  • LizzieSt

    My favorite remains: “If my mother had breastfed me, I wouldn’t have asthma and I wouldn’t be allergic to cats.”

    From one of my husband’s hippie friends who apparently has never heard of the concept of genetic inheritance. His own mother has asthma for crying out loud.

    • Azuran

      Then why is my breastfeed boyfriend allergic to cats and borderline asthmatic?

    • Puffin

      I was breastfed and have asthma and cat (and other) allergies. Apparently this woman doesn’t understand the concept of atopy.

      • LizzieSt

        It’s a man. 🙂 And no, he certainly doesn’t.

    • StephanieA

      I was breastfed until I was 2 and have pretty bad seasonal allergies, as well as cat allergies.

      • Lizz

        Same here but also severe food allergies,eczema and chronic asthma. My Brother was the same and had terrible allergies and ear tubes twice. My BIL was basically deaf for a couple years from chronic ear infections while being exclusively breastfed for six months and then on to a year and a half. I always figured maybe we were just the weird one’s until I actually read the papers.

        I distinctly remember laughing when WIC tried to tell me my son had some mild asthma during colds because I only made it to four months and that my daughter the preemie wouldn’t have ear infections if I’d nursed her. Apparently it’s rude to laugh when someone tells you something ridiculous. Who knew?

    • Valerie

      Yeah, I have a friend who has asthma (as did her brother as a child), and the doctor told her she should breastfeed for at least a year to prevent asthma in her son. We didn’t talk about it at length, but I get the impression breastfeeding was a hardship for her, and she may have stopped much earlier if she had more accurate information.

  • Anne Catherine

    You have outdone yourself, yet again, Dr. Amy!

  • Bombshellrisa

    “Formula feeding is like feeding your child McDonalds for every meal”
    “Breast feeding makes your child a gourmet early”
    “Breast milk adjusts itself to give your child exactly what they need”

    • Tiffany Aching

      “Breast milk adjusts itself to give your child exactly what they need”

      This one I heard very often and it makes me crazy. I can get how supply might adapt to demand but how could your mammary glands know what nutrients your baby needs ? Do these people have some kind of quantic transmission of information based theory to explain that ?

  • Beth7000

    I got “you have to be 100% committed to your child to breastfeed” from my dingbat SIL. Yep, not committed to my daughter at all because she drinks Enfamil…

  • Amazed

    OT: A question for the OBs and CNMs here. My SIL is due in the beginning of February… kind of. Up until yesterday, the baby was measuring consistently large for her GA and the OB said that she should be out earlier. Moving the due date. At least, that’s what the Intruder and SIL always explained to me. I always thought they didn’t quite understand what the doctor said. I mean, a due date is a due date, right? You cannot turn it around just because of this or that.

    Yesterday, the baby measured just right for her GA, so the doctor reverted to the first due date?! Is such a thing even possible? What could it be that we don’t understand? And is there a reason to worry because of this last measurement? Could it be a sign of her not growing quite right?

    She’s had all the tests, both required and optional. Everything seems fine. But this moving of the due date worries me a little. Most likely, it isn’t moving of the due date at all but some recommendations, like “it isn’t this safe to wait longer than this or that date.” Could that be it?

    • Medwife

      I’m going to propose a simple misunderstanding. When they do an obstetric ultrasound, the size of the baby is often reported as what EDD it fits- the baby is EGA 26 weeks with a due date of Feb 1st, but the EDD from a 7 week ultrasound was Jan 15th. Then they do another scan a couple weeks later and the size matches an EDD of 1/25 again. The actual due date hasn’t changed. I see this misunderstanding a lot and have asked our ultrasonographer to stop saying the growth EDD.

      • Amazed

        Thanks! I was almost sure it was a misunderstanding, I simply wasn’t sure WHAT it was. After all, if everything looks as great as they believe, she can’t have TWO due dates! But I’m relieved to have a confirmation of what probably happened by someone who’s in the game, so to speak.

    • demodocus

      Apparently, my babies show up smallish on the ultrasound for their gestational age. Which is weird when they’re concieved in a petri dish, and therefore we know exactly how old they are.

      • Amazed

        Yeah, I know such things happen sometimes. But if your drawer-turning hurricane is any indication, they have enough energy for all the (bad) ideas required!

  • OttawaAlison

    I forgot the following greatest hit:

    “When you know better, you do better”

    • Petanque

      How about “Crap in a Can”

      • Charybdis

        I thought that was Spam?

        • Bombshellrisa

          That is salted crap in a can. Real crap in a can is that spray cheese stuff.

          • Charybdis

            Hey, my dog loves the spray cheese inside a kong. She adores that stuff.

          • Bombshellrisa

            Mine do too, but you know we are considered abusive to our animals for feeding them the stuff. People who “really love” their pets would feed them raw, vegan diets that they prepare from foods obtained at the farmers markets or Whole Foods.

          • The Computer Ate My Nym

            But dogs are carnivores. Well, omnivores, but much more to the carnivore side of things than humans. And cats, well, show me a well-nourished vegan cat and I’ll show you a good hunter. Yeah, I know you’re being sarcastic but there do seem to be people out there who don’t understand that pets have different dietary requirements than humans.

        • Spamamander

          Hey now!

  • OttawaAlison

    “Formula is full of chemicals”

    “Formula fed is vastly inferior”

    “Formula is 4th on WHO’s hierarchy of infant feeding”.

    “If you don’t want to breastfeed why have kids?”

    “women in poor countries always make enough”.

    “Breastmilk is the perfect food”

    • namaste863

      I love “Formula is full of chemicals,” All matter is, by definition, chemicals. If it exists, it’s made of chemicals. Hell, oxygen is a chemical. That’s why my stock response to “Do you eat Organic?” is “Sure I do, it’s carbon based, isn’t it?”

      • BeatriceC

        My favorite stupid label was a bag of sugar that loudly proclaimed to be carbon free. That was a head-scratcher. I know now that the carbon free labeling was in reference to a specific processing method, but still it was funny.

        • Blue Chocobo

          I’ve seen bags of sugar with “fat free” labels. That’s one way to spin it…

          • Box of Salt

            Sugar = carbohydrate.

            No fat involved. Fats are completely different chemicals, and metabolized by different pathways. It’s not spin – it’s reality.

          • Mom of 3

            Yeah, Blue Chocobo knows that, that’s why it’s funny. It’s amazing what people will fall for.

          • Box of Salt

            Yeah, it spun past me.

            Earlier in the week someone had told me that nutrition class had taught that consumed sugar becomes fat. . . . no wonder folks get confused.

          • Bombshellrisa

            Or the labels on sugar that say “gluten free”. I always look and think “um, ok”.

          • The Bofa on the Sofa

            Gluten free yellow mustard

          • An Actual Attorney

            I saw gluten free skin lotion.

          • Box of Salt

            “gluten free skin lotion”
            Well, that could be important, depending on where you apply the lotion, and when . . . .

          • Dr Kitty

            Wheat germ oil and hydrolysed wheat protein are present in some skin care products and do contain gluten.
            But unless it is a lip balm or you accidentally swallow your lotion it won’t be a problem, even if you are coeliac, because gluten molecules are too big to be absorbed transdermally.

          • Who?

            This is interesting-I have a gluten intolerant (not, mind you, coeliac) friend who swears blind she gets a rash if she so much as touches things containing gluten.

          • Bombshellrisa

            Gluten free corn tortilla chips.

          • Roadstergal

            Angry Orchard hard cider (yum) advertises as gluten free.

          • Box of Salt

            Angry Orchard gluten free – probably because it’s shelved with the beer.

          • Azuran

            I saw a pack of strawberry with a ‘no trans fat’ label

          • MichelleJo

            Cholesterol free oil.

        • Amy M

          How about that pink Himalayan sea salt that claims to be “GMO free?”

          • Charybdis

            Then I have a GMO free lamp? How trendy is that?!

          • Mishimoo

            And an organic salt (the review skewering that claim was beautiful)

          • Box of Salt

            But Mishimoo “And an organic salt” – most drugs actually are organic salts (i.e., salt form of an organic compound).

            Inquiring minds want to know where the DNA is within sodium chloride.

          • Mishimoo

            Aliens, it’s always aliens 😉

      • Sarah

        I think we as a species would be in a lot of trouble if breastmilk wasn’t also full of chemicals…

    • SporkParade

      I’ve also heard, “Formula is chock-full of sugar.” Like, yeah, idiots, it’s a replacement for human milk, which has even more sugar than cows’ milk, which is already full of sugar.

  • Zoey

    I have so many of these… “Have you tried to eliminating dairy?” or “Have you had her checked for ties?”

    • Megan

      “Have you had her checked for ties?”

      THIS.

    • Bugsy

      Heh – the LC told me to eliminate all dairy, including all breads and processed foods, when #1 suddenly had blood in his stool at 3 months. Having eaten dairy steadily since he was born, I ignored her and instead gave up the tree nuts I had introduced into my diet a week earlier. Bingo. Blood disappeared.

      • SporkParade

        In all fairness, dairy was the culprit for us, and the intolerance only developed at around 3 months. My pediatrician didn’t, however, suggest getting rid of bread and processed foods.

        • Inmara

          I think the reason for eliminating said products is that many of them contain dairy. I’m on a dairy free diet myself and it immediately excludes myriad of store-bought foods, even some which wouldn’t have dairy if made at home. To figure out what’s the culprit for atopic symptoms (developed since 3 months) I’ve excluded eggs and wheat too – well, now there are some challenges if I want to make muffins (which I do!) or eat outside home.

          • yentavegan

            If mother has to start eliminating whole healthy nutritious foods from her diet because her otherwise healthy, thriving breastfed baby has sensitivities I suggest get a second opinion from a medical doctor specializing in allergies.

          • Inmara

            Well, the thing is that for such small babies only way to find out allergen is eliminating food and seeing if it improves symptoms, and the elimination phase should be at least 3 weeks before any improvement is visible (that’s the opinion of most pediatricians and allergologists). I’m not suffering in any way – there are tons of recipes in internet, and many substitutes for dairy, eggs and wheat are available in stores. I could drop breastfeeding completely because it’s 2 out of 6 feeds per day anyway, but I’d like to find out the cause of allergy before we start introducing solids.
            Which leads to question I’ve been willing to ask you (if you have time to spare for an answer) – how exactly does one stop breastfeeding? My supply has been lowering during past month and seems that part of milk is produced during feeding rather than between feedings, thus making hard to pump. Baby is feeding around 4.30-6 AM and then after waking up 7-8 AM, after that it’s bottle and I’m expressing milk around 13 and 20 (switched to 2 pumpings from 3 recently). I suppose that I could switch to 1 pumping during the day and 1-2 feeds in early morning. And then? What happens with already produced milk if it’s not expressed, does it somehow absorbs back into body? (Stupid questions, I know, but I’ve never researched it before and I guess you as LC know these things).

          • yentavegan

            Yes. Milk that is not expressed does get re-absorbed. If you become painfully full you can hand express just to relieve the pressure. If you pump and fully express a feeding your body will continue to produce milk.

          • Inmara

            Thanks!

          • yentavegan

            some mothers weigh the pros and cons of elimination diets against the infant’s sensitivity issues . Fussy/gassy rashy otherwise healthy infants can tolerate the offending allergen. If baby is losing weight, bleeding from the gut , inconsolable sometimes a formula is the right choice.

          • Angharad

            If it helps at all, many babies outgrow their allergies and sensitivities, especially to milk and eggs. I stopped breastfeeding when my baby was diagnosed with allergies to everything under the sun (milk, soy, eggs, and tree nuts) confirmed by blood tests and it was just too much to cut out. She now can eat everything except plain eggs (small amounts of egg in baked goods are ok) and tree nuts.

          • Blue Chocobo

            Milk already stored in the breasts will eventually be reabsorbed, the last bit after stopping breastfeeding completely won’t stay in there forever!

            Stopping suddenly if you’re producing a lot can cause problems from engorgement, but if production is already below half of baby’s total needs you can taper down pretty quickly without a lot of worry.

            If you want to stop completely, the fastest and least uncomfortable way is to just feed/pump when uncomfortably full (which could be 3 times a day, once a day, once every two days, etc). Those times will become farther apart over the course of a few days to two weeks, depending on how quickly the glands get the message.

            If you just want to drop a feed from the schedule, you can just start skipping it. You may feel a little fuller for a few days, but production will adjust downward and that will stop. The milk from the skipped feed will just be stored until the next feed until milk production timing adjusts to the new schedule.

          • Inmara

            Thank you, this was very helpful!

          • Blue Chocobo

            To think about with food allergies in babies:

            When you start introducing solids to a baby that is already tolerating formula well, you are basically starting from a place that is like a very strict elimination diet. You just add only one new food per week and watch for symptoms. Much easier than trying to eliminate things one by one from a typical adult diet.

            Some babies are just colicky, and it has nothing to do with diet. It’s just how they are and it’s nobody’s fault and there’s nothing to fix. They do outgrow it. Until they outgrow it, life with them can be incredibly difficult. It does get much, much better in time. Parents of colicky babies need support and assistance, it is a VERY trying phase.

            Just things to think about and talk over with your doctor if you think it may apply to your situation.

          • Inmara

            Fortunately, colic ended at 7 weeks and we haven’t had huge problems with digestive tract except spit-ups a bit above average (they are gradually decreasing during last weeks). But then I read that some gastroenterologists think infrequent bowel movement (like, once in 3 days or less) is due to cow milk intolerance and completely healthy babies should poop at least daily. I know it’s a bit controversial but there were some convincing anecdata about eliminating dairy which improved atopic symptoms as well as digestion. My baby is combo fed and eating goat milk based formula so I decided to give a try for cow dairy elimination. From my observations, it makes his poop a bit more frequent and less sticky so probably there is SOME effect of it (or maybe it’s just effect of breastmilk – who knows?). The biggest concern for me now is atopic symptoms which he started to develop since 3 months old. I’m trying to figure out what could be culprit and it seems that he flares up after I have had some food out of home so it’s plausible that there IS something in my diet that he’s not tolerating. Dropping BF for some days didn’t improve symptoms but there should be longer elimination period to have any conclusion. Anyway, I’ll experiment a few weeks more and then start to introduce solids, starting from most benign vegetables which shouldn’t cause any allergies and then we’ll see how it goes.

          • Box of Salt

            Inmara “But then I read that some gastroenterologists think infrequent bowel
            movement (like, once in 3 days or less) is due to cow milk intolerance
            and completely healthy babies should poop at least daily.”

            Where did you read that? I’d like more information.

            I am also amused, as my own kids were the opposite of that: the one that pooped daily did not tolerate cow’s milk, and the one who pooped once a week has no problems digesting it (drinks lots).

          • Inmara

            Unfortunately, it was not any reputable source, just local mommy forum and one mother recited what her doctor had said (and I don’t know doctor’s name either to look up whether he/she had expressed this opinion elsewhere). It could be the case of doctor extrapolating her observations without any science to back it up but somehow this got stuck in my head and I couldn’t resist to try dairy elimination. Maybe it’s because otherwise baby is doing really well and sleeping like a champ, so I just had to create some difficulties to do this motherhood thing properly 😀

          • Dr Kitty

            Pooping anywhere from after every feed to once a week is considered normal for breastfed babies provided the stool is soft, they aren’t distressed passing it and there is no blood in the nappy.

            If you are eliminating things from your diet, you need to do it under the supervision of a dietician. Nursing mothers need calcium, vitamin D, fats and calories. Talk to someone about how you can ensure you get what you need.

        • Bugsy

          That’s good to know…yep, my LC did suggest getting rid of everything that had dairy, even in the most remote amounts. (To make matters worse, she was also a nurse at my ped’s office.) From a mental well-being standpoint, there was no way I could have followed her recommendation – I’ve had dietary/food issues for most of my life and had just come off of having GD. Giving up dairy would have put me over the edge, but of course, it was framed as “you do what’s best for the baby.”

          Thankfully tree nuts were the only issue at play, and #1 outgrew it with time.

  • MaineJen

    “No other species on the planet feeds their children the milk of other animals.”

    • Dr Kitty

      Ants milk aphids for honeydew, so eating excretions of other species isn’t just a human thing…

      • Nick Sanders

        Milk is a secretion, not an excretion.

    • Amy

      No other species wipes their ass with toilet paper after pooping either

      • crazy grad mama

        Yeah, I can think of a huge long list of things that “no other species on the planet” does. Like purify their water before drinking. Or wear clothes. Or read.

        • Roadstergal

          Live-tweet their homebirths.

        • Megan

          Makes bread or yogurt using their vaginal flora. Ok, I think the animals win here…

          • BeatriceC

            Do people seriously do that? That’s a whole new order of disgusting.

          • Megan
          • BeatriceC

            I’m afraid to click on those links.

          • yentavegan

            oh no…I read the opening title on the first link while eating breakfast!!!

          • Allie

            Yup, it is even more disgusting than the girl I used to know who “watered” her plants with her menstrual fluid each month. If plants are capable of considering suicide, I’m sure hers would have considered it.

          • Charybdis

            Uh, what the hell for? Did she have an Audrey from Little Shop of Horrors or was she making a blood sacrifice to the plant gods for some favor, like making brussels sprouts taste good or making kale taste like bacon?

          • crazy grad mama

            +1 for Little Shop of Horrors reference.

          • Tosca

            My mother has a blood disorder that is best treated with regular “bleedings” (like blood donations). At the time our local bloodbank couldn’t use her blood, so it was just going to be thrown out. She insisted on taking it home and putting it on the garden. She’s a retired farmer and figured it was no worse than blood-and-bone fertiliser.

      • Azuran

        Many other species also wash their private part with their tongue.

    • AirPlant

      Posts adorable YouTube video of a cat nursing a puppy.

      • BeatriceC

        Or that picture of the piglets wrapped in tiger strapped blankets nursing from a mama tiger.

      • Daleth

        Cat nursing squirrel
        Cat nursing hedgehog
        Dog nursing [insert random mammal here]
        …and it turns out those babies are fine!

      • Tiffany Aching

        “Unlikely animal frienships” is my favorite google search when I’m feeling blue.

    • Blue Chocobo

      Or uses Facebook…

      • BeatriceC

        I might have to argue with you about the whole Facebook thing. I had a mastiff that loved watching videos of other dogs. I’m pretty sure he spent his days trying to figure out how to get my computer to play them himself.

  • MaineJen

    “When you know better, you DO better”

  • Zoey

    Can’t forget “breastfeeding is the biological norm” or “I practice full-term breastfeeding” (instead of extended breastfeeding).

  • crazy grad mama

    Ohhhhhhhh yes, you’re right. He missed out on all that good vaginal flora and it messed up his digestive tract for life.

    [That’s sarcasm 🙂 ]

  • yentavegan

    if your baby is having difficulty nursing, the pediatrician is the wrong professional to consult.

    • demodocus

      My son’s ped is the one who helped me figure it out. Not the LCs. Hopefully those three work fine for other women…

    • Dr Kitty

      Ugh…
      This is how hypotonia and aspiration get missed.
      If your baby simply cannot figure out sucking and swallowing, or is not thriving, please get them assessed by a doctor.

      • yentavegan

        I am playing bingo…my comment was snarky

        • Dr Kitty

          Oh yeah, I know.

    • KeeperOfTheBooks

      Why?
      My pediatrician successfully nursed her daughter well into toddlerhood, and gave me some sensible advice about it.
      The lactation consultants and LLL leaders, on the other hand, told me I wasn’t trying hard enough (by pumping/feeding round the clock?), implied that should ignore DD’s weight loss and dehydration and that I had somehow “ruined” her by supplementing with formula via an SNS when she did lose too much weight, and generally made my life a living hell until I stopped listening to them.

      • yentavegan

        Snark, not serious

    • Tiffany Aching

      I read the “your pediatrician doesn’t know anything about breastfeeding and you really shouldn’t listen to him” thing so often it is scary. I really don’t understand how so many mothers would rather trust some strangers on the internet over their pediatrician.

  • crazy grad mama

    “Breastfeeding reduces your risk of postpartum depression.”

    “All mothers would choose to breastfeed if they only knew all the facts.”

    • Madtowngirl

      “Educate yourself!”

    • OttawaAlison

      Your second line is where the problem lays. All these people wholeheartedly believe that formula is harmful and dismiss any of the evidence that demonstrates that it is fine and can help a child thrive and be healthy!

    • BeatriceC

      “Breastfeeding reduces your risk of PPD”

      Unless in increases your risk because of exhaustion, difficulty in establishing supply, latch problems, etc.

      • crazy grad mama

        Which is borne out by the data: women who want to breastfeed but don’t have greater rates of PPD. The arrow of causation probably runs the other way, too, in that being depressed makes it harder to breastfeed.

      • LeighW

        I call bullshit on that one. Struggling to BF made my PPD so much wrose. Nothing like being told you’re not trying hard enough to perk you up!

        • demodocus

          I think Beatrice and cgm are too.

          • BeatriceC

            Yup. I think that line is utter horse poopy. I know cgm was adding it to the list of “lactivism bingo” squares, and I quoted it to add my eye-rolly counterpoint to it.

  • yentavegan

    the diapers /excrement of formula fed babies is toxic to the environment. Breastmilk fed babies diapers/excrement is not toxic to the environment.

    • crazy grad mama

      “A breastfed baby’s poop doesn’t smell bad.”

      • BeatriceC

        To be fair, at least with my very small sample, the poop from breastmilk smelled slightly less bad than the formula poop. It didn’t smell good, mind you, just not as bad.

        • crazy grad mama

          I’ve heard that, and I don’t actually have direct experience with formula poop to compare. All I know is that after the first few weeks, my breastfed kid’s poop smelled BAD.

          Edited to add: I’m sure lactivists would tell me that I was eating something wrong. Or that it was the Vit D drops.

          • MaineJen

            My breastfed kid’s poop turned green when I’d had too much chocolate! Fun times…

          • namaste863

            Too much chocolate? There’s no such thing!

          • Dr Kitty

            Oh goodness, the number of phone calls I get about baby poop!

            If it is green, yellow, brown or orange it is fine. Which exact shade isn’t important.
            If it is red, white or black, it isn’t OK and I need to see them. Now.

            Breast fed babies often have completely liquid stools.
            That is fine.
            It isn’t diarrhoea.
            I know your mother tells you she’s never seen the like, but she formula fed all her kids, breast fed baby poop is often less solid.
            Yes, I know it goes up their back and out their legs and all over their clothes, but it doesn’t require any treatment other than soaking the stained clothing in a good stain remover.
            No, I can’t give you something to bung them up a bit.

            It is also fine if your breast fed baby only poops twice a week, as long as they don’t seem distressed when they do and there is no blood in the nappy.
            They don’t need a laxative.

          • BeatriceC

            Ahhh, the good old days of first time motherhood. I remember being hyper-paranoid about every little thing. These days I’m all “is there bone sticking through your skin or blood pouring from your eyeballs? No, then go take some advil, you’ll be fine.”

            Well, maybe not that extreme, but it takes quite a bit more than it used to for me to get worried about something.

          • Inmara

            Can you elaborate about green poop? I’ve seen numerous claims that it means either lactose or milk protein intolerance, and good poop should look yellowish or brownish. My baby had mustard -like poop while EBF, but with goat milk formula it’s greenish brown (showed a picture to pediatrician, she said it’s fine. Yes, I have pictures of poop in my smartphone)

          • Toni35

            My oldest had green poop until I figured out how to get my oversupply under control. With my other kids I already knew what to do, so they never had green poop, just orange/yellow/tan. It could be a sign of too much foremilk, not enough hindmilk* especially if you have oversupply.

            *i am not a doctor, nurse, or LC, if your child’s doc says it is fine, it is in all likelihood just that – perfectly fine. Just sharing my experience as a nursing mother.

          • Inmara

            I’m aware of oversupply as a potential cause of green poop, but it’s not the case (I’m combo feeding and lately baby gets most of his nutrition from formula). Thanks for suggestion, though!

          • BeatriceC

            Random aside: the tendency to keep medical pictures in one’s smart phone doesn’t go away once the child potty trains. I have x-ray images, pictures of various wounds (surgical and accidental), and several shots of an odd reaction the youngest had to the adhesive that held the cardiac monitors to his chest during his last surgery.

          • Guest

            When EBF my kid’s poop turned green when I ate a bunch of green veggies. Also, now that he’s eating some solids – when he eats a bunch of green veggies.

          • Rachele Willoughby

            Wait until you introduce him to jello.

          • Dr Kitty

            CMPI or lactose intolerance cause bad nappy rash and acidic, foul smelling stools that are occasionally dark green/black because of bleeding in the gut due to irritation.

            Normal baby poop in a thriving infant without nappy rash or colic that just happens to be greenish instead of yellow, no big deal.

            People love bringing me nappies or pictures of nappies. I can confirm that normal baby poop comes in a wide spectrum of colours.

          • Inmara

            Thank you!

          • MaineJen

            Interesting. My daughter is sporadically lactose intolerant (I swear, it seems to come and go…sometimes just one piece of cheese will give her the runs for days, other times she can eat yogurt and drink milk all day long with no problems), and when she was an infant she had about the worst diaper rash I’d ever seen. I did end up having to give her soy formula.

            Is it normal for lactose intolerance to come and go like that?

          • The Bofa on the Sofa

            When our older guy was 4-5 mos , he would go 2 weeks between poops

          • crazy grad mama

            So jealous! My little guy was pooping 3 or 4 times a day at that age. I swear he woke himself up pooping more often than he woke up because of hunger.

        • Kelly

          There is definitely a different smell but in four to six months when they eat solids, it will be ten times worse so who really cares. I mean sour milk is sour milk and it smells bad.

      • Dr Kitty

        Kind of agree.
        My kids nappies smelt like sour yogurt, not poop, (at least until solids were added for #1, #2 is yet to try solids).
        Same with vomit- just smells like sour milk, not vomit.
        Not pleasant smells, just preferable to formula poop and vomit (which I am around a lot, due to work).

        • crazy grad mama

          Spit-up was like that for me, too: just milk-smelling. Solid food vomit has been a whole ‘nother story.

          • Mom2Many

            As a foster mom, there’s been a few times where we were transporting breast milk from the mom to my home. Even though I breastfed my own children, I have to be honest that it was a touch different to handle a virtual stranger’s bodily fluids. The ‘ick’ factor simply was something that we had to overcome, but knowing that our babies come from parents with high risk lifestyles, it was not always easy. The hardest was when they threw breast milk up on us. Even after many years of fostering, that one we’ve never gotten used to!

          • Blue Chocobo

            I didn’t like handling my OWN breast milk. Leaks while nursing or from early random letdowns are no big deal, but once it was “packaged”, it was just weird.

          • Inmara

            My baby eats goat milk based formula and his spit -up smells like fermented goat milk. Which I hate, I have never been able to eat goat cheese or other goat milk products because its specific odor makes me want to womit.

        • ElaineF

          I exclusively breastfed both my kids, but after I introduced an iron supplement with my second one and before starting solids, his poops got really nasty. I theorized the iron in formula is what causes the “gross” formula poops.

          • demodocus

            I was on iron the whole time with my boy, and I thought his ebf poop only smelled yeasty. (Then the solids came into his diet. Phew)

      • Allie P

        My breastfeeding baby’s poop doesn’t smell too bad. Her gas, however, can clear a room.

    • Megan

      Honestly I noticed no difference between the breastmilk poo and the formula poo. (I think it somewhat depends on the type of formula as well.) Solids are another story…

      • Megan

        I’m talking about the smell here. Sorry, I wasn’t terribly specific.

  • Roadstergal

    “I don’t need to vaccinate, I breastfeed.”

  • Dr Kitty

    You forgot “It only hurts if you’re doing it wrong” which is the biggest lie of all of them.

    Nipples are sensitive, babies are clumsy. I firmly believe that even with a perfect latch and positioning breastfeeding HURTS for a while, until it suddenly doesn’t any more.
    For me it took six weeks with both babies, YMMV. That’s what my mum told me happened with her and all three of us, so I don’t think it is just me either.
    They both had good latches, there was nothing odd going on, it just hurt.

    I was OK waiting it out to see if it got better, because it hurt, but not severely, not everyone is as lucky regarding length of time and pain level, so if you decide to stop, that is FINE.

    It gets easier with time, but if those first few weeks and months are miserable for you, even when everything is “right” I just don’t think you should have to martyr yourself. No judgement from me.

    • BeatriceC

      I’m a fair skinned red-head with almost-but-not-quite flat nipples. Apologizing for the TMI, but they can get chapped if MrC pays a little too much attention to them. Learning to breastfeed had some painful moments.

      That said, I think denying that learning to nurse can sometimes be painful could potentially cause more women to fail than just admitting that sometimes it just plain hurts, but most women will eventually find their nipples toughen up and it will stop hurting. If women are convinced that something is wrong with them because their nipples hurt, instead of realizing that that sensitive skin is just taking some time to get used to the new function, they can start a downward spiral that eventually leads to simply not enjoying it, guilt, and cessation of nursing entirely.

      Not all women, of course, will fit into that category, but some will.

      • Dr Kitty

        I’ve had more than one woman in tears at her six week check because BF hurts, and she’s tried shields and had the latch checked, and pumped as much as possible and done everything…and it still hurts.
        I’ll ask if I can see her feed, and I’ll generally agree everything looks right.
        Then I’ll ask if she wants to stop, or combo feed, or set a time limit (if things aren’t better in X weeks I’ll stop) or if she just wanted to ventilate her feelings and carry on BF. Then we work out how to make her preferred plan possible.

        I think that telling women that I had the same issues, but that it got better and I successfully BF my eldest for over a year helps if they want to continue, but I’m not going to push anyone into BF longer than she wants to.

      • Inmara

        Fortunately, midwife in prenatal class warned us that it’s going to hurt for at least two weeks. For me, latching was painful while feeding was not; a good latch could be noticed by any observer nearby because I was always gasping when it happened.

      • Zornorph

        I learned that women’s nipples toughen from breastfeeding by watching The Silence of the Lambs, lol.

    • Toni35

      Yup! With all four of my kids there was a three to four week desensitization period before bfing stopped hurting. It wasn’t horrible, and only at the beginning of the feeding, but it was definitely painful. I knew to expect it with my subsequent children, but with my first it came pretty close to leading me to stop – I thought that bfing wasn’t supposed to hurt if you were “doing it right” and her latch was great, she was growing and gaining well… I thought something must be “wrong”. Fortunately I came across a passage in a lactation book (provided in my formula gift bag by Similac) that explained that this is normal, as well as how long it lasts and when to seek help. I was kinda pissed that the lactavists never bothered mentioning this. It would have saved a good deal of worry and frustration.

    • demodocus

      6 weeks at least for me too, though i never found it pleasant.

    • Are you nuts

      That is such a cruel lie and one told by so many LCs! I can think of one person who honestly didn’t think BFing hurt. Everyone else uses words like cheese grater, barracuda…

  • Nick Sanders

    What about “Creamy hind milk”?

    • AirPlant

      (shuddering)

    • Zoey

      Oooh worse, how about calling milk with blood in it “Strawberry milk.” I’m still traumatized.

      • Roadstergal

        You are shitting me. I don’t want to vomit so early in the weekend…

        • Zoey

          I wish I was. Members of the crazy AP group I used to belong to would sometimes post pictures of pink or red milk and ask if it was safe for the baby to drink. The answer was inevitably something like “It’s totally fine! It’s just strawberry milk!”

          • Nick Sanders

            Grossness aside, blood curdles in the stomach because it tries to clot. It’s not a good thing to ingest.

          • Allie P

            When my baby started vomiting up black stuff I was so scared I called my doc, who calmly asked if my nipples were bleeding…

          • Dr Kitty

            Exactly.
            It’s good to know if mum has nipple trauma if baby has blood in nappy or vomit.
            Ingesting maternal blood is a GOOD reason for bloody stools or vomit.
            Otherwise it is an ER visit and many unpleasant tests.

          • Charybdis

            It is also not a good thing to vomit. Ever.

          • crazy grad mama

            Why would anyone WANT to nurse on bleeding nipples?!?

          • Roadstergal

            Bleeding Nipples – another excellent name for an all-female punk band, but not a good thing in just about any other context.

          • Sarah

            I suppose that’s one way of combating the relatively low iron levels in breastmilk.

          • Dr Kitty

            If your nipples are bleeding so much that the milk is RED you need to re-evaluate things.
            Maybe it means shields or pumping, maybe it means combo feeding to give your nipples a chance to heal, but it should never mean “carry on doing exactly what you are doing”.

      • crazy grad mama

        Ew. Ew ew ew ew ew ew ew ew ew.

      • Nick Sanders

        I hadn’t seen that one.

      • Laura

        Oh my word, that’s disgusting!

      • Rachele Willoughby

        When I first started pumping for my preemie I was seeing blood in the colostrum by day two. I called down to the nurse’s station to let them know and they’re like “Don’t worry, the blood won’t hurt the baby!”

        Well… um… that wasn’t exactly what I was worried about…

  • Amy M

    Where do they get the “we could save billions!” line from? I mean, individuals who don’t have to buy formula, and who don’t have to spend a lot on getting breastfeeding to work save a thousand or two. But, if most women breastfed exclusively, for 6mos-1yr, that would likely decrease the number of women in the work force. Then, there’s a potential loss of productivity for the company. There’s the individual loss of income/savings if a woman quits working. Where are these billions?

    • EmbraceYourInnerCrone

      Well the there’s this from the Ohio Department of Health website

      (keeping in mind I think most of these claims are VASTLY over-inflated or complete Bull Shit) :

      http://www.odh.ohio.gov/en/features/odhfeatures/breastfeeding.aspx

      The benefits of breastfeeding include:

      • Improved developmental and psychosocial outcomes
      • Increased mother/infant bonding
      • Reduced health care costs
      • Less environmental waste and
      • Reduced infant mortality

      Breastfeeding is linked to decreased risk of:

      • Sudden Infant Death Syndrome (SIDS)
      • Necrotizing enterocolitis (NEC)
      • Ear infections
      • GI infections
      • Celiac disease
      • Inflammatory bowel disease
      • Obesity
      • Diabetes
      • Childhood leukemia and lymphoma
      • Better neurodevelopmental outcomes

      According to the American Academy of Pediatrics, if 90 percent of the babies in the U.S. were breastfed exclusively for 6 months, we could save $13 billion per year. More importantly, we could prevent 911 excess infant deaths each year. For Ohio, this would translate to about 33 Ohio babies who could be saved each year.

      Why is the American Academy of Pediatrics promoting these unfounded or over inflated points?

      • EmbraceYourInnerCrone

        I guess -supposedly – the U.S. could save money in health care costs if all women were “encouraged” to breast feed. Again I think that claim is complete bull. Also what happened to bodily autonomy?

        • crazy grad mama

          Not to mention, how much money do we spend “encouraging” women to breastfeed?

          • Roadstergal

            And how much money is lost to treating dehydrated/malnourished/jaundiced babies?

      • Valerie

        Those fanciful “if 90% were exclusively breastfed” figures come from Melissa Bartick- who has been discussed on this blog, including where she got those numbers from. http://www.skepticalob.com/2012/07/dr-bartick-whos-really-fueling-mommy.html

      • Roadstergal

        It’s a Thing, isn’t it, talking about the protective effects against NEC but not noting this doesn’t apply to term infants – and no noting that pacifiers are also very protective against SIDS, and probably more achievable and implement-able for a lot of families.

        I mean, with the rest of it, I shouldn’t be annoyed at those in particular – but I am, because there’s a germ of truth that’s been twisted beyond any degree of perspective. And because it really shows that they don’t care about the babies – because if they did, they’d be pushing pacifier use as strongly as breastfeeding. “Both of these help, and even if you can only do one, it still reduces your chance of your baby _dying_…”

        • Poogles

          “talking about the protective effects against NEC but not noting this doesn’t apply to term infants ”

          Not to mention that not all breastmilk has the same protective effect in preterm babies, IIRC.

          • Roadstergal

            Nope. You have to win the biological lottery on that one.

      • Bugsy

        Has anyone attempted to link formula feeding to autism yet? If they haven’t, no doubt it’s coming.

    • Liz Leyden

      According to the USDA, 57-68% of infant formula in the US is purchased through WIC. Presumably, if more women breastfed their babies, states would be able to spend that money on something else.

      http://www.ers.usda.gov/publications/err-economic-research-report/err93.aspx

      http://www.wsj.com/articles/makers-of-baby-formula-press-their-case-on-wic-program-1430177799

      • crazy grad mama

        Maybe… Although I’d guess that some fraction of WIC formula needed by mothers who are working low-paying jobs that aren’t amenable to pumping. If those women were to stay home to breastfeed, states might have to pay more in other welfare benefits.

      • BeatriceC

        However, WIC pays for food for the mother if the mother is nursing, so it’s a wash.

    • Bugsy

      And from personal experience, breastfeeding never causes our food bills to go down…my caloric intake increases to the point that I doubt BF is s financial win.

  • AirPlant

    The free space really should have been “TRY HARDER”. I swear that is what I hear the most…

    • Blue Chocobo

      Followed by an “inspiring” story of someone who tandem breastfed for 5 years, with only one breast (that had an inverted nipple), through 5 kinds of ties and 10 bouts of mastitis, while in a coma, on Mt. Everest, and it was all worth it because she didn’t have to buy formula during the zombie apocalypse.

      • Inmara

        /applause/

      • denise

        I remember a story this nurse shared during our prenatal classes Apparently some poor woman had had a breast reduction surgery. She would always call the Clsc (local Quebec health centre) and cry about how much she wanted to give breast milk to her child. She would pump all day long. Apparently finally she managed to produce 25ml of breastmilk a day and fed it to her baby. The nurse shared this “heroic” story as an example of “anyone can breastfeed (or produce breast milk) if they tried hard enough”. I shudder when I think how much time this woman must have away from her baby, spent utterly stressed out.

      • MicheleHS

        Laughing so hard at this. I’ve known women to go through just about as much while breastfeeding. I applaud their dedication, but at the same time I wouldn’t blame anyone for hitting their limit earlier or just having a different approach to feeding their baby (formula, combo, donor milk, whatevs) – so long as it’s nutritionally appropriate, it’s all good. The only things I can’t get behind are weird DIY formula recipes found on the internet, with strange milk substitutes like unfortified coconut milk or what have you that leave the baby malnourished.